Working to cheap and cutting others throats


#1

People and companys always complain and wonder about losing work to hacks, fly by night companys, and people w/ no ins or wc. Don’t you think that we as Professional roofers and business people promote, create, and support this by installing roofs as cheap as we do. I have been reading some of the offers on this site and I am shocked that people are willing to go out of town, pay all the expenses, housing, travel, food, etc to roof for 40 per square. is that even worth your time back home? Well i guess I should be glad you guys are willing to do it so i don;t have to. What bothers me is it ends up circling around then every company is expected to work for that price. every time you cut another subs throat you hand them the knife to cut your throat right back. Guys remember insurance work pays very well. Especially when there is an overwhelming amount of it. Perfect example I bidded 8 new restaurant flat roofs(all identical w/ the same general contractor and they wanted a package price). I Faxed them a bid to do all 8 of them in 2 states. 3 days later they called me back and said that the restaurant requested my services because i do all of there service work and reroofs(thats actually why the general gave me a bid package). The general wanted to fulfill the request of their customer and use me but, i was $19,000.00 to expensive. They would give me the work if i would lower my price $19,000.00. I denied it 3 weeks later an ex employee of mine who now owns his own company got the contract for a price that was $26,000.00 cheaper than my bid. Now new construction is easy to bid there are no what if’s or hidden surprises. I figured material which designated by the general, plus my labor at a cost of $49.00 per hour and I lost the bid. i felt that was a conservative bid and i thought with those numbers I would win the contract.


#2

Yeah. I just got licensed, bonded, and insured. I have lost 5 of 6 bids to someone with a lower price. I am suddenly feeling the knife on my throat. I am a product of the union and take care in everything that I do on a roof. I know that a good mechanic is about $70.00 per hr at a reputable shop so that is what I charge per man hour. I add it all up to a total so it isn’t open ended and in my experience customers don’t like the hourly thing. One of the people I lost a job from admitted she knew the other company had to be using “slave labor” but she was willing to “take the risk”. Another one just wants to use somebody who is freelancing for cash. Another one said I was 33% higher than the second highest bid. I know what I know and I am being fair in all of my estimates but I am getting shafted by CHEATERS! This is pissing me off a little and I’m not sure what to do except somehow get work from people who don’t only care about the lowest price. Yes it’s true, you get what you pay for right? Well my last employer has about 50 workers out in the field and I was the only white guy. My eyes were opened by one of the bilingual guys. He told me that 95% of all the guys here were illegal with fake papers and I.D. They do ok work because of all the training and supervision by a superintendent who is not afraid of acting like a dick. Especially to white guys. Soooooo… here is my question: How in the hell am I going to compete with all these companies that cheat when everyone (customers, contractors, politicians) just wants the price and doesn’t care about the legal risk? It makes me want to call immigration on these exploiters but I am not a snitch and I know what these guys are going through because it’s even worse in Mexico. I’ve made some good friends that are Mexican workers but they are just stuck getting paid shit wages and long hours, no benes, overtime, etc… WTF!!! This post is long as hell and yes I am crying like a bitch but I refuse to cheat!

Sincerely,
Samuel Bailey
Leak Chasers Roofing


#3

Yeah. I just got licensed, bonded, and insured. I have lost 5 of 6 bids to someone with a lower price. I am suddenly feeling the knife on my throat. I am a product of the union and take care in everything that I do on a roof. I know that a good mechanic is about $70.00 per hr at a reputable shop so that is what I charge per man hour. I add it all up to a total so it isn’t open ended and in my experience customers don’t like the hourly thing. One of the people I lost a job from admitted she knew the other company had to be using “slave labor” but she was willing to “take the risk”. Another one just wants to use somebody who is freelancing for cash. Another one said I was 33% higher than the second highest bid. I know what I know and I am being fair in all of my estimates but I am getting shafted by CHEATERS! This is pissing me off a little and I’m not sure what to do except somehow get work from people who don’t only care about the lowest price. Yes it’s true, you get what you pay for right? Well my last employer has about 50 workers out in the field and I was the only white guy. My eyes were opened by one of the bilingual guys. He told me that 95% of all the guys here were illegal with fake papers and I.D. They do ok work because of all the training and supervision by a superintendent who is not afraid of acting like a dick. Especially to white guys. Soooooo… here is my question: How in the hell am I going to compete with all these companies that cheat when everyone (customers, contractors, politicians) just wants the price and doesn’t care about the legal risk? It makes me want to call immigration on these exploiters but I am not a snitch and I know what these guys are going through because it’s even worse in Mexico. I’ve made some good friends that are Mexican workers but they are just stuck getting paid shit wages and long hours, no benes, overtime, etc… WTF!!! This post is long as hell and yes I am crying like a bitch but I refuse to cheat!

Sincerely,
Samuel Bailey
Leak Chasers Roofing


#4

Without being an advocate for labor here I got to say this:
If’n a fella isn’t getting treated right he may very well leave.
A contractor should very be getting high $200’s per sq. here in my area, Get over $300 it’s fine w/ me too. ME? I can hardly get out the $200-220 range. But I’m not a salesman either.
On the other hand if the contractor who is getting $300 per sq. is chasing down lowlife, unreliable labor and trying to get the job done for $40 a sq. then he is part of the problem, not the solution.
Why work for him? I can bid my own work and get almost three times as much for my workmanship.
And most guys 'round here are happy to be picking up $50 a sq - or less ( no insurance of course- no paperwork or warranty either. E-Z work :evil: )

As a sidenote- I would be happy subbing for $80-100 per sq. But when I’m constantly told that I’m too expensive, well I guess I’m on my own then :frowning:


#5

posting in here cause i agree with everything said in here and youguys sound like qualty roofers lol it is hard to find good qualty workers ive been doing roofing for about 20-+years more or less cause i was 5 when my dad got me on a roof and im 32 now ive seen all kinds of my dad is 72 and been doing roofing 50 years+ the market for roofing has goon to the dogs it would seam. ps:my dad has never been licened or bonded cause every body knows him in my area and he has never scamed anybody that i know of.a few years back me and 2 of my brothers did a job i knew he underbid the job but i went along with it hopeing we could just get it done and go to the next job but…it didnt work out that way we built a porch and a roof all the way around the house and built a roof over it and resheeted it after tearing the old shingles off then roofed the entire roof.it was about 15-20 square for only 6000±but we did what we said we would do and then they didnt pay us off but oh well.never underbid in my option lol:?