Roof question for the experts (new shingles lifting)


#1

I had a new roof installed at the beginning of October 2007 and I am starting to see several areas where the shingles appear to be lifting up. My house is located in upstate NY and the weather was fairly mild during the actual instillation. The original shingles that were on the house were the standard 3-tab asphalt type that needed to be replaced but were still laying pretty flat on the roof (so I am fairly certain that the roof decking was in good shape).

The new shingles are GAF Timberline 30-year architectural and initially they were all laying neat and flat during the first month after instillation. However, the weather started to turn cold and now I am noticing several areas where the shingles are starting to lift. I am not noticing any leaks at all (seems pretty water tight) but the appearance of these raised shingles are causing me some concern.

The contractor has not been back to see these areas in person but over the phone he said that this is normal; I want to know if this looks normal to you guys. I am aware that sometimes new shingles can lift due to the weather and that over time the heat of the sun will help them to settle down but I just want to make sure this is the case.

Again, the shingles did not appear to be lifting like this for the first month and I am pretty happy with the overall appearance of the roof. However, now that the shingles are starting to lift, I am a bit concerned. The other areas of the roof (not pictured) that get a lot of sun seem to be lying perfectly flat but the areas in question (pictured) do not get much sun at all, especially during the winter months, and I’m assuming this is part of the problem. I’m hoping that over time these shingles will sit back down like they originally did when first installed.

Here are a few pictures of the areas in question:
Picture 1 i29.photobucket.com/albums/c276/fflyboy/1a.jpg
Picture 2 i29.photobucket.com/albums/c276/fflyboy/2a.jpg
Picture 3 i29.photobucket.com/albums/c276/fflyboy/3a.jpg
Picture 4 i29.photobucket.com/albums/c276/fflyboy/4a.jpg
Picture 5 i29.photobucket.com/albums/c276/fflyboy/5a.jpg
Picture 6 i29.photobucket.com/albums/c276/fflyboy/6a.jpg
Picture 7 i29.photobucket.com/albums/c276/fflyboy/7a.jpg

Pictures 1, 2, and 3 are all of the front side and 4, 5, 6, and 7 are all of the back side at different angles. The back side is my main concern.

In looking at these pictures, does this look normal? Do you think I need to address these areas or should I just wait until the spring when the weather warms up and see what happens? As I said before, there appear to be no leaks but cosmetically I really do not want my brand new roof to look like this.
If this is normal and will fix itself over time, then I can live with it for now.

Thanks in advance for any advice and help!


#2

not sure but it could be the ventalation,you have ridge vent with gable vents,and no soffitt vents.but i could be wrong


#3

One thing that it may be is the roofer installed the shingles wrong.

I take it the roofer didn’t tearoff the old shingles. Being an overlay, the roofer should have shorted the first course of shingles and butted the shingles from there. He didn’t short the first course, so you will see about every 3 ft. the edge of shingles pop up along the whole course all the way across the roof. It will do this up the whole roof after it all lays down.

Some say this application voids the warranty.

Even if this isn’t the cause of the problem, the shingles are still layed wrong.


#4

I’ve only seen one roof that even came close to looking like that.We did a 40 square roof and 1 whole pallet was bundles that came off the bottom of the stacks,every bundle had real bad grooves from the pallet from being on the bottom of the stack for a long period of time.I didn’t want to nail them on but the contractor made the call.


#5

Well Elks are like Bushhog described, but that only causes fishmouths. THey’s slow to install because each has to be pressed into place before nailing.

BUT… I have never seen this issue before. Even driving down the road! IMHO, I think you have defective shingles,a defective installer, or both.

This one is new to me.


#6

yeah i just dont think that roof has seen enough heat yet to lay down.
you may have to wait until spring and some 90 degree days, before you know what ya got.

gweedo.


#7

Well 1 thing is for certain there is not soffit ventilation and well with the ridge vent like someone mentioned it could be the problem but i doubt it. Although the warranty of the roof is voided with his install like that. I have never seen anything liek that before. But you do not have a warranty from GAF of that install that i know for sure.


#8

I just noticed something else. I don’t see that the step step flashing exits from behind the siding on that Bay Window. Looks like it deadends into the turned down J-channel.


#9

I appreciate all of the feedback guys!

My home does not have any eave overhangs, and the original roof did not have a ridge vent in place, so the ventilation could possibly be the problem. However, the other side of the roof that you cannot see in the pictures is lying perfectly flat and has the same ventilation system. Wouldn’t improper ventilation create this problem on both sides (throughout the entire roof)?

This roof is NOT an overlay. The original shingles were completely removed and new underlayment and shingles were installed.

I’ve read about how the way shingles are stored can affect their performance once installed. However, these shingles were in great condition when they were first installed. This is the confusing part to me. It definitely seems as though the temperature change had something to do with it. The guy who installed the roof was pretty meticulous and seemed to know what he was doing.

I spoke with the contractor this evening and he is supposed to send down the guy who installed the roof to take a look at the problem. I am hoping that it is because the roof has not seen enough heat yet. Like I said before, the side of the roof that was blasted with sun back in October is perfectly flat. It’s just on this other side that I am seeing this issue.

Could you elaborate more on this? Why is my warranty void? Is it because of insufficient intake for the ride vent? How do people without eave overhangs remedy this? I would like to know more about this for when the contractor show up to inspect this situation.
-Thanks!


#10

From the pictures it looks like you have a “cold weather” installation.
When the shingles are packaged and stacked (especially with plastic wrappers) They tend to come out of the package “bent” or “wavy” (sometimes they are frozen together…).
When it is cold outside the shingles don’t get a chance to relax.
They are stiff as a board…
As a result, when the shingles are laid they don’t lay flat to the roof.
In places where the shingle is “humped” up you should press it down with your nail gun THEN pull the trigger.
If you do this the shingle will be flat against the roof and you won’t have problems with blow throughs and nails not seating all the way.

“nails not seating all the way”

Well you stated that your roof was done in Oct, I think it had enough sun the take care of the "cold weather " effect, maybe not.
You said that the shingles layed flat for a while then started to curl.
This would be rather unusual.
Once a good day of sun hits the shingles they will seal down, they won’t curl back up…
Once the sun hits the shingle, it warms up all of the adhesives holding the shingle together, this lets it relax and lay flat.
It doesn’t have to be warm for this to happen, just sunny.

G - Tape wrote:

If you didn’t have the old roof removed and just went over it, well this is what happens…
The old roof is most likely put on at a 5" exposure, common for 3-tabs.
Well, Timberlines have a 5 5/8" advertised (it is actually 5 1/2"…) exposure.
This means that the shingles won’t “nest” correctly.
In other words, as you move up the roof you will run into bigger voids in the nailing area.
This will cause the shingles to buckle at the nailing area, but once they seal down they tend to stay that way…
Other than cold weather application or going over and existing roof I can’t explain your roofing problem.

If it is a defective shingle…
Good luck with getting GAF to stand behind it…


#11

I’m guessing that the decking was 1x6’s or some type of solid sheeting.
So i’ll say that it might be possible that the boards were cupped , and with the cool weather it broke the seal.


#12

It still looks like shingles that were laid out length wise with the boards on the bottom of the pallet for a long period of time and are just disfigured.You won’t see them shingles lay down until next summer .


#13

The 300 rule is in effect when ridge vent is used. Therefore soffit vents must be used or any other intake product. Looking at your roof you have zero intake. Therefore the ridge vent will not work. That will void your warranty in a snap.

There is a product called smart vent and a product called drip vent. Either of these 2 can be used and i can see you do not have either of them. The company you had out installed shingles, not a roofing system. I know for a fact GAF will not stand behind that. Axiom might be right on that front be either way there is zero intake so that equals no warranty from gaf. Only way to fix is tear up a bunch or the roof and well not a good idea. Call a roofing sypply house and get the number for the GAF rep in your area and see if he will come out and look at it, i doubt he will but he might. Sad to say it but the job was not done correctly looking at the ventilation from what i can see.


#14

Lets start with an easy question…is the side thats laying down nice and flat facing the south?

Is this side that isnt facing east or north?

I would have to guess it just hasnt gotten warm enough to make the shingles lay nice and flat.


#15

Hi,

You can put intake vents in and you still will not get air to go to the ridge. Intake is useless on this house.

The second floor is finished. There is no passage for the air to get from the eaves to the ridge.

You did not need ridge vent. The gable vents were the only vents you needed.


#16

The first thing I’d do is call up the contractor and explain to them the principals of attic ventilation. You can find great info at www.airvent.com. Explain to them that you hired them based a trust that they were knowlagable and experienced.

Ask them to come back and remove the existing form of ventilation, “ridge vent” and install static vents. Explain to them that you clearly understand that your roof can prematurely fail due to improper ventilation and that they could be held liable for improper installation should the former happen.

Once the correct type of ventilation is installed you are safe, forgoing any other incorrect installation methods, to have have a manf. rep look at the shingles.

I’ve never seen anything like that and I suspect that something is wrong with the shingles. You might be lucky and it could just be those shingles or there could be more and you might have to have a lot more replaced.


#17

edited for poor reading comprehension …thanks ridge


#18

The shingles were installed back in October and accoring to the OP the weather was suitable. Also the OP stated that after the install the shingles were all laying down. Then once it got cold they popped up. To me it looks like some of those areas that are raised are the whole length of the shingle!


#19

U da man :mrgreen:


#20

[quote=“shingle monkey”]Lets start with an easy question…is the side thats laying down nice and flat facing the south?

Is this side that isnt facing east or north?

I would have to guess it just hasnt gotten warm enough to make the shingles lay nice and flat.[/quote]

Yes, the side that is laying down flat is the south side and the north side is the trouble spot…

[quote=“Lefty”]Hi,

You can put intake vents in and you still will not get air to go to the ridge. Intake is useless on this house.

The second floor is finished. There is no passage for the air to get from the eaves to the ridge.

You did not need ridge vent. The gable vents were the only vents you needed.[/quote]

The original roof did not have the ridge vent, only the gable vents. The roofer added the ride vent on this instillation. The second floor is only finished on the part of the roof that has the window…the other part of the roof (left of the valley in picture 1)has attic space with insulation.

This is correct, the instillation was done in suitable weather and all of the shingles appeared to be perfectly flat for the first few weeks after instillation. The areas in the rear part of the house that are raised are the whole length of the shingle. When I get a chance I will post some more pictures illustrating the original roof and showing the areas of the new roof (south side) that seem to be OK.