My roof quote w/pics; your thoughts please UPDATE


#1

First things first…

Many thanks to everyone who took the time to reply to my inquiry. Your insights and recommendations were most helpful. It enabled me to prepare myself for the task of getting future bids. Not something I was looking forward to after the first one I received. All points of view were valid and I agreed with many of them. Where we differ is okay too…Understanding why we differ and why we do the things we do is more important than the difference itself. We can agree to disagree and still learn from one another.

The most important thing I learned here was to find a real ROOFER. I am happy to report that I did and signed the contract today.

The roofing company is a father and sons team, doing subroofing for 20 years and finally went out on their own 4 yrs ago. Kudos to them! They came and climbed up on this two story house and measured every piece of roof and told me EXACTLY what I had. One called out the numbers, while the other wrote them down. The oldest jokingly chided with his younger sibling telling him what part of the job was his (turrett). They worked as a TEAM measuring this roof and were having a few laughs in the process. Real decent folks. And here is the cliff hanger…

They were the subs who did another house of mine 7 years ago! I knew those young boys (alittle older and few pounds heavier) the minute I laid eyes on them! Talk about coming full circle…I still get chills thinking about it because I silently prayed to find them! They did a superb job on that other house and I fully expect the same thing on this one.

Again, thank you all so much for teaching me the in’s and out’s of roofing. I never had a clue…

I have only 1 layer (not 2) so we are doing a 20 square layover of 30yr arch shingles, drip edge, chimney flashing, and debril removal for $4500. He’s not the cheapest, and he’s not the most expensive. What he is… He’s fair, honest, and takes pride in his work. For that, I will glady pay his price. He’s happy and I’m happy. Who could ask for more?

Gigi


#2

I’m not a roofer but I can tell you your instincts are good. I’ve sold for home improvement companies; essentially they are sales companies and will worry how to do the job after they get the sale. The price drop on your hesitation is standard. Reminds me of the “Columbo close” - “uh, just one more thing…”

When I sold siding & windows for a Sears sub, 45 or 55% of the contract price went straight to Sears, leaving approx half for the job and commission.

Find a real roofer. One of the roofers on the site will probably refer you to someone local to you and throw in a few caveats.


#3

No way I could even ballpark your quote without knowing things like debris removal, changing flashing, etc. I tell you this, we give every customer a detailed full proposal with all the fine print and everything to sign. Never assume anything if it isn’t in black and white. How do you merit an extra 15yr warranty, is that an Elk thing?!

-Get every project detail in writing.

-Prices will depend heavily on area so I would suggest getting at least 3-4 quotes to compare.

-Nothing is free…nothing.

-Beware of choosing the lowest bidder. Quite often you get what you pay for.

That job would closer to 22k here in Westchester but then we get 95.00$ for a sheet of cdx.


#4

holy crap…thats the highest i have ever heard, and 22k sounds high as well. not busting your balls or talking crap, but if thats a 2 layer with no cedar it would be 12-15k in upstate NY. i strongly agree about getting more estimates. if someone can drop the price 25% just like that…then they can probably drop the quality 25% as well. call “roofing” comapnies. most importantly, i try to sell trust…so if your gut says no then your answer to him should be no.


#5

Thank you for the replies, iopsailor & tar monkey.

I guess it must be a busy season for roofing. I’m still waiting for call backs from the messages I’ve left on answering machines. It will be interesting to see what others come in at…until then, I’m sticking with my gut on this one.

As far as the Elk extra 15 yr. warranty; I was told that he is given 8 or so of these certificates per year to use as he feels fit…maybe to make the sale? Dunno. Or maybe he does alot of roof and uses their product more than others and he gets them that way??? Dunno. He did tell me that they’ve done 450 jobs (last year or so far this year), hard to remember everything he said, so maybe alot of them were roofs…

Assuming the sheathing is all good…why is the price so high? Because it’s two story and not walkable, or is it walkable?? I realize there’s the valleys and flashing issues, a bit of cut up. Is that why?

I’m still in sticker shock over this one. I should change careers…

Thanks again for taking the time to reply.

Gigi


#6

also be cautious of the ELK warranty as it may not make a difference soon. ELK was bought out by GAF. they sent me a letter the other day stating that we would know what the future will hold by the end of july.


#7

[quote=“marshall exteriors”]

holy crap…thats the highest i have ever heard, and 22k sounds high as well. not busting your balls or talking crap, but if thats a 2 layer with no cedar it would be 12-15k in upstate NY. i strongly agree about getting more estimates. if someone can drop the price 25% just like that…then they can probably drop the quality 25% as well. call “roofing” comapnies. most importantly, i try to sell trust…so if your gut says no then your answer to him should be no.[/quote]

Thanks for your input. Here in southern Delaware, code says that the original cedar shakes can stay, so they won’t be removed.

I’m with you, this is a $12k job tops. And that’s being very generous, imho. :smiley:

Maybe those extra Elk warranty certificates won’t be worth the paper their written on…Company takeovers and buyouts can be a scarey time for everyone involved, i.e. employers, producers, distributors, consumers, etc… That extra 15 years isn’t going to make this deal, I assure you.

Thanks again.

Gigi


#8

“holy crap…thats the highest i have ever heard, and 22k sounds high as well.”

Yeah, I don’t doubt it. Like I said though, area means everything and Westchester County is what…like 3rd richest area in the united states I think. Last I checked, it was right up there with Greenwich Conn. and Hollywood Ca. People here have sick money but be ready for a lawsuit if you so much as leave one nail on the property, lol. Everyone here is super high maintenance so it’s a double edged sword.


#9

i would not leave the old cedar, code or not. it is gonna look like crap. and i would personally turn the job down if the homeowner told me to leave the cedar. if my name is going on the job it is gonna look 100% as well as function 100%…no scimping. after all your job will be my billboard for your neighborhood. seeing how it does have cedar (which i suspected from the design and age of the house) it will probably be closer to 15k with new 7/16 osb after cedar is torn off. that price will be from a roofing company who is insured to do roofing. a “construction” company price will probably be cheaper as thier ins. rates are much lower…but the ins. also doesnt cover roofing.


#10

Hi,

He dropped the price because the homeowner did not want new decking.

He did not just drop the price.

I get $90 a sheet for 1/2". If you get less. You never figured out what it cost you to replace a sheet of plywood.


#11

i still dont get why on a cedar tear off (which in my area gets new plywood no matter what) a $10 sheet of plywood, $1.00 in stick nails, and 5 minutes (if that) of time = those kinds of prices. i would think that $10 sheet + $1 nails + say 2guys (1 to cut 1 to nail) @ $15.00/hr plus cost of employement of $9.90/hr per man for a labor total of $49.80 / 12 (the 5 minute thing) = $4.15 for a grand total of $15.15 plus lets just double that for variables +$30.30 now add 100% profit (which is way high imo)= $60.60. im not saying your wrong for doing it…but damn, i couldnt sleep at night. if you can get those kind of prices and still stay busy …more power to ya…[size=75]hows that for a math equation :smiley: [/size]


#12

i wouldnt do it w/out removing the cedar as it dryrots over time w/out proper breathing(under shingles),i also see a flat area ,is that being done also??for the shingle work w/new decking,i would get around 18,000.00 for that job(w/debris removal)w/30 yr timberline/or similar---i think youre just in sticker shock :frowning:


#13

I was in the same boat as you a few years back. I took a trip to the attic and saw water stains on the roof plywood. I called for a couple roofers to come out for estimates. My house was 2000 sf ranch with 500 sf garage attached. Low pitch w/ a gable causing 2 valleys. Flashing around chimney and vents. I also knew from the inside plywood would have to be replaced. The first estimate was 4,500.00 and the second was 6,500.00. I thought those were high estimates! I am a do it yourselfer and took a week off work got my wife’s father and went to work. The total cost of supplies was $1,500.00-1,700.00. I found that roofing is not difficult, but it is physically gruelling!!! By ten o’clock it was 80 deg and impossible for me to work. I had 2 layers of shingle to remove and soon found out that the previous owners had the gutters replaced. Whoever replaced the gutters drove the support nails through the shingles into the ply wood. When it rained, water damaged 6 inches of plywood around the whole circumference of the house. That had to be replaced.
It took me five days to complete the job. This is what I’m trying to tell you.

Research an expensive job.
The two estimates I got were so inconsistent that I had to learn why. There is a book I got on Amazon for $30.00. Its called *Means Residential Repair and Remodeling Costs. *This book gives you a breakdown of costs for a job in units. It also has an adjustment for cost of living formula for different states. That is an excellent start. Plus if you know what a job entails and kind of know what you are talking about-less likely to get ripped off.

Reduce Cost by doing some of the work yourself.
Demolition is easy and will save you cash.

Also Know about other jobs that tie into what you need done.
I had no idea that some idiot would nail gutter support through the shingles. I didn’t know to look for it. Be sure to inspect the whole jobsite for possible problems.

The internet is an excellent tool for research, but don’t stop until you get answers. I noticed you had a few replies and a couple of people give you roundabout answers as if they gave you a professional estimate you would track em down and hold em to it. I know you just want prices and for what. Watch out for people who do not answer direct questions with a direct response, they are testing you to see how much you give them.

GOOD LUCK


#14

“I noticed you had a few replies and a couple of people give you roundabout answers as if they gave you a professional estimate you would track em down and hold em to it. I know you just want prices and for what. Watch out for people who do not answer direct questions with a direct response, they are testing you to see how much you give them.”

As it stands here it is often difficult to give concrete advice over the internet without being able to inspect the job site. Also the OP is looking for pricing and as I said it depends heavily on location. Since this particular jobsite is not in my work region I can’t offer that information because my numbers won’t be accurate with his locale.


#15

[quote=“Tar Monkey”]“holy crap…thats the highest i have ever heard, and 22k sounds high as well.”

Yeah, I don’t doubt it. Like I said though, area means everything and Westchester County is what…like 3rd richest area in the united states I think. Last I checked, it was right up there with Greenwich Conn. and Hollywood Ca. People here have sick money but be ready for a lawsuit if you so much as leave one nail on the property, lol. Everyone here is super high maintenance so it’s a double edged sword.[/quote]

You might want to look again. I am from Fairfax County, although I now live in Texas. I was always told Fairfax was the richest county in the richest nation. Here is what I found when I looked it up:

Rank City Median household income, 2004
1 Fairfax County, VA $88,100
2 Somerset County, NJ $84,892
3 Morris County, NJ $83,583
4 Montgomery County, MD $82,971
5 Howard County, MD $82,065
6 Nassau County, NY $78,762
7 Prince William, VA $77,678
8 Monmouth County, NJ $77,223
9 Rockland County, NY $75,306
10 Santa Clara County, CA $74,509
11 Fairfield County, CT $73,110
12 Chester County, PA $72,288
13 Suffolk County, NY $71,956
14 McHenry County, IL $71,153
15 Bergen County, NJ $70,957
16 Norfolk County, MA $70,903
17 Lake County, IL $70,347
18 Middlesex County, NJ $70,344
19 DuPage County, IL $70,174
20 Westchester County, NY $70,095

Here is the link:

dcjobsource.com/richest.html

And for what it is worth, the reason I left Fairfax was because I could never seem to get ahead there. Since moving to Tx I’ve bought a 3,000 square foot house with a detached two car garage and life is good.

This one shows per capita, but it is from wikipedia so take it for what it is worth:

Rank County Per Capita
Income
1 Marin County, California $44,962
2 New York County, New York (Manhattan) $42,922
3 Falls Church, Virginia $41,052
4 Pitkin County, Colorado $40,811
5 Fairfield County, Connecticut $38,350
6 Teton County, Wyoming $38,260
7 Somerset County, New Jersey $37,970
8 Arlington County, Virginia $37,706
9 City of Alexandria, Virginia[1] $37,645
10 Morris County, New Jersey $36,964
11 Fairfax County, Virginia $36,888
12 Westchester County, New York $36,726
13 Hunterdon County, New Jersey $36,370
14 San Mateo County, California $36,045
15 Montgomery County, Maryland $35,684
16 San Miguel County, Colorado $35,329
17 Douglas County, Colorado $34,848
18 Los Alamos County, New Mexico $34,646
19 San Francisco County, California $34,556
20 Summit County, Utah $33,767

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Highest-in … ted_States

And then there is this one:

Loudoun County (pronounced “LOUD-un”; IPA: 'laÊŠdnÌ©]) is a county located in the Commonwealth of Virginia, a state of the United States, and is part of the Washington Metropolitan Area. As of July 2005, the county is estimated to be home to 255,518 people, a 50 percent increase over the 2000 figure of 169,599. That increase makes the county the fastest growing in the United States during that period. Its county seat is Leesburg6.

In 2005, Loudoun County emerged as the wealthiest jurisdiction in the nation, with its households having a median income of more than $98,000, followed by it’s neighbor Fairfax County at $94,610.


#16

"You might want to look again. I am from Fairfax County, although I now live in Texas. I was always told Fairfax was the richest county in the richest nation. Here is what I found when I looked it up: "

Geez, I’m sorry… Let me rephrase my statement.

My numbers would be off in comparison to the OPs locale because we do buisness in ONE of the richest countys in the U.S. We fell from number 3 to number 20 while I wasn’t looking.

I mean honestly does it matter?! The point I was making stays the same, Christ… I’m not even going to waste 5mins of my life googling to try and dispute that, you win at nitpick cookie No wonder this forum is always dead.


#17

prices are dictated by overhead costs,general liability is more in ny than delaware,and more in westchester than rockland,because the agents pay rent in westchester which is more expensive than rockland county where i live,also workers comp is different in different areas,rockland(roofing)48 per 100,indiana 21 per 100,delaware is also less than ny,1,000,000.00 liability cost me 15,000.0 per yr to start before i make money,same policy 6 hrs away in pittsburgh ,pa can be bought for 1,000.00 to start-thats why people don`t generally quote prices outside their area,in some parts of texas,you can buy a house for what roof,siding,and windows will cost you in ny,—not 1 upmanship just plain facts-tarmonkeys statement was sound reasoning


#18

tarmonkey e-mail me please,it`s in my profile


#19

What Tar Monkey said… you had me right up until you said folks were avoiding an answer to the questions.

There’s no way any of us could ever guarantee a figure for work based on even the most detailed photos & descriptions here or on any site.

I’m also sure there are other issues to this or any other job that only a professional with years of experience can find or notice.

Roofing, especially on 20+ year old structures, is like doing surgery 100 years ago - no advance X rays, no blood tests… & the patient doesn’t talk to let you know where it hurts.