Coming or Going?


#1

Another Spring’s a-coming. What will this year bring? I read in the Boston Globe the other day about the collapse of the subprime mortgage market and this can’t be good for anyone. As a former loan officer, I can tell you that many of these people getting foreclosed had no business nor could they afford these houses to begin with, but the property sales it generated created arguably the biggest housing boom in American History. Now with the demand on the marketplace sure to shrink, and housing values sure to fall, Joe Homeowner will no longer be able to tap into that wonderful equity he’s been living off of for ten years (because ther won’t be any), and may not have the money for Joe Roofer.

 What to do now? Well, for everyone its different, but this roofer is headed to the repair market again. The cost to run a legitimate and fully equipped roofing crew just doesn't seem feasible to me anymore. This is like the days in the late 80's and early 90's (geez, guess who was president, suprise, suprise) where the saying was "You can feed a family for a week with a gallon of Karnak." Rolled- "roofers" were in high demand. People tarred the joints of vinyl-sided dormer cheeks. Yup, I see the future and it isn't pretty.

 Suffice to say, I'm done whining about illegal-immigrants now. They're the least of my problems and surely will be going home when they find out theres no work here either! Thats all for now

 ----Mr. Pessimistic

#2

sounds to me that maybe you need help with sales. im already booked well into the season. i dont care what the economy is. bottom line “EVERBODY HAS A ROOF…AT SOME POINT, EVERYBODY WILL NEED A ROOF.”

even if this was the case (your theory on the market). why would you post it here to scare away the people that come here for advise. now they may second guess replacing their roof, and you wont get the call that you may otherwise gotten.

p.s. this should be listed under business talk


#3

You know what? Don’t get all high and mighty with me, you’re just a human being like me. I seem to remember like 6 months to a year a go, you posted a subject saying,“what do ya’ll do in the winter.” I believe roofboss responded with this exact quote, “we’re roofers, we roof.” And I sympathized with you, for I am mere mortal.

Life is not always perfect and crap happens. What happened, you adapted your life to the general consensus of roofing.com? I am me and will always be me and if somebody feels the need to sensor me, so be it. I say what is on my mind and I’m proud of that. I’m not a robot dedicated to politics, but an animal in the jungle ready to fight for the food on my table, metaphorically speaking. I’m a survivor and a fighter born and bread, but I have the equal mix of needing a clear conscience.

I’m a contributor to this site, surely I’m allowed to get something back. If I need to vent a concern, I think I’ve earned it by sharing what I have experienced with other people for free. I’ve got some burn-marks, gashes, and nail holes to show on my skin for what I got… and I wasn’t clumsy.

This isn’t so much business as it is a rant. So what?


#4

WOW marshall, thats not like you…

Hey, I’ll admit it, I’m probably one of the best salesmen around, but you know what??? I haven’t had a roofing call in over 2 months!!! People around here can’t afford it! As for the foreclosures, here in Michigan, the industry is expecting 50% forclosure rate this year alone on houses. With a rate like that, where are people going to get the money to reroof their houses? I am hearing most states are starting the same economy, which leads me to believe that they too are starting to hold onto their money alittle tighter.

The one thing I disagree with S&G about is that the illegals won’t be going home. This economy is making more and more of these illegal and illigitamate roofers. To them, they are raking in the money. To an unemployeed guy, he is making tons of money. He goes and throws on a roof, collects the check and puts it right in his pocket. He is gone before the rain hits and when the roof starts leaking, he can’t be found. He didn’t give any of that money to the Gov., he didn’t give any of the money to the insurance companies, he didn’t give any of the money to any employees. He kept it all to himself, so he thinks he is rich and will do it again and again, until he gets a real job, or gets in trouble, of even falls off the roof. He will only leave his new profession when something better comes along.
Another great salesman is gtp, he too, hasn’t had any calls. so being the great salesman is great if you have someone to sell to, but if you don’t, that skill is wasted.

S&G, you are going about it in the right way. If something isn’t working…like reroofing, then turn yourself around and do something that is bringing in the customers, like repairs. There is a HUGE market for repair work right now. As a matter of fact, there are a few of us on here that are making a pretty good penny in that market alone.

Myself, I am pretty busy just doing repairs. But the thing with repairs is that you need to know how to do them. In the last 4 jobs that I have done and am in the process of doing, every single roofer/repair guy has been fired off the job and has been replaced by me! One of the bigger accounts that I got, I even told the owner to fire the roofer they are using now and I’ll take over. They did!! and I have written about $5000 in repairs in the last 2 weeks for them alone.

At this point, even if I do get a call for a shingle roof, I will most likely decline the estimate chance. I know for a fact that my legitamate price will be undercut by every illegal and illegitamate “roofer” out there. I don’t have a chance, and why waste my time, when I have a pretty good chance of coming back to that roof in a month of two and doubling my profit on a repair rather than the whole reroof??

S&G, you’re doing the right thing, you aren’t giving up and you are finding what works. I have no doubt that you will do fine.


#5

Why thanks for the complement G-tape i apprecaited it. I am currently working on finding another gig. Met with a guy lastnight for about 5 hours so we will see where this goes. He said he has leads and seems to be honest.


#6

I agree with Severance and do like he does. I state what I think and don’t sugar coat it. You either like it or you don’t.

**G-tape **- it has been a slow winter in Michigan is absolutely correct. Up until about 2 weeks ago we only did a maybe 2 jobs a week. Now the tax time is coming up and some have gotten there refunds, we are doing a job a day if not 2. We are getting 15+ phone leads a day. A good salesman who can close and get the $$ is a true positive. Although, repairs are also a good money maker. Everyone has there own niche. Severance sounds like he is doing what he feels will make him the $$. Run with it Severance and let us know how it is working out for you.

Since joining this board, I have talked to gtp-1003 a few times on the phone about this and that and even asked around if peeps are looking for a good salesman. Gtp lives 10 mins from my house and yet I am trying to help him out. I hate seeing good talent go to waste. If we had more calls and needed the help, I would call gtp right away but we don’t and have just enough to keep me busy at this time.

**G-tape **- your statement about “At this point, even if I do get a call for a shingle roof, I will most likely decline the estimate chance. I know for a fact that my legitimate price will be undercut by every illegal and illegitimate “roofer” out there. I don’t have a chance, and why waste my time” makes me wonder when you also say “Hey, I’ll admit it, I’m probably one of the best salesmen around” A good salesman should be able to overcome objections and “sell” himself and the company he represents. To just throw in the towel and not even try is concerning. Im sure you are good at what you do and I was shocked to hear the first statement out of you (the second didn’t shock me at all - it just seems that is how u r) but if that works for you - it works for you.

I pound every lead that comes into our office. Sure I’m not going to get everyone but if you don’t try, nothing will pay nothing. I sell what I sell and do it at the best ability that I can and try to get the most $$ that I can in each and every sales call. Do I get what I want everytime - No but I certaintly don’t do jobs and not make any money. Repairs are what I call instant money. Sell those on the spot and usually have my repair guy out within 24-48 hours to complete it. Repairs are always necessary due to the many hacks in the roofing business. Severance can make some good $$ at it as he and everyone else could at anything they put effort into and do it correctly.

Marshall - when you say “im already booked well into the season” what does that mean to you ? I was just wondering what kind of #'s considers one booked into the season. I’m glad to hear you have the work and sounds like the work is plentiful for you. You are surely doing things right.

Enough for now. I’m sure I’ll get responses to the above and will respond back.


#7

Fair enough Tim, the only thing I have to add is…

If marshall is that busy, someone should have told him to raise his prices a long time ago. hes leaving ALOT of money on the table!!!


#8

you’re reading my mind G-tape - I was thinking the same thing. We’ll have to wait for his response.


#9

mere mortals.

gweedo


#10

I appreciate the kudos gents. I gotta find something soon or im gonna be hit. Getting very worried. Money is running out here.


#11

Well I believe your all right . This is a time of rapidily changing times and if we don’t adapt with the change we face elimination , especially so if you are a mediocre roofer . Gentlemen I believe the time is already here where homeowners are educated enough to see they need to take caution when hiring a roofer . Quite frankly I’d hire the one smart enough that covers all his bases but yet takes some risks . Speak your minds . . . people respect that no matter how brutal the truth .


#12

first off let me apologize for how that may have come across. it wasnt meant as a bashing, merely a conversation. maybe i shouldnt have highlighted it in bold (haha). i dont want to totally rveal my ave price per square. but lets say i average over $300. and 70% of my roofs are GAF ultras or better. probably my best assett for having this work is the lack of ANY quality competition. [size=75]shhhh[/size]. also i live eat and breathe making myself a better salesman every day and go to every seminar on sales withing 100 miles of me. so once again maybe i was in a bad mood …but i meant no disrespect. :wink:


#13

If you were in a bad mood when you wrote it, think of how bad of a mood I was in when I read it. Apology accepted. I don’t make these things up man, like G-Tape says, all the sales skills in the world don’t help when there is nobody to sell to. I’ve done 3 estimates I had no chance at since November.

There’s a point where confidence has to meet reality when they’re miles apart. Where I live, there are literally 19 pages in the yellow pages of roofing companies from 4 towns. Somethings got to give.

A guy that I discredited to a potential customer here a few weeks ago is a state representative and as I stated to that customer, the guy has more brand new trucks than American Citizens, how can I compete with that? Really. His price is half, YES HALF of mine, and if I say something he could easily sabotage me with his political clout but I said something anyway, because I don’t care anymore. When he shows up for some election there I will be with the pictures I got of his illegal crew and the date and time taken, then he can explain his workmens comp fraud. If it was just about money I could just blackmail him, but it’s not about that. It’s about justice. And fairness. And a level playing field. He is one of the largest offenders of the very laws he is voting on.

So I guess I find myself back to the issue of the illegals. I’m telling you, I am not racist. I do have some sympathy for the issues going on in other countries. My issue, is that it is the rich capitalizing on the poor and cutting the middle class out per usual. I fought damn hard to not be poor and I’m not going back, but these pigs are doing everything in their power to put me back there. I have anger and hatred, but I will use it constructively.

Now that my blood is boiling pretty good too, let’s talk about this $400,000,000,000 expense in Iraq… how many possible flourishing small-businesses could this money have helped in the form of loans and grants, and how would that have changed the economy? Don’t you think that money would’ve multiplied rather than blown up?

You’re damn right I’m pissed. I’m pissed that I had to sit through a history class about the Declaration of Independence, The Bill of Rights, The Constitution, etc, and adapted them as my principles when it was all really a smoke and mirror show. Seems we only fought Hitler because he was cutting into our action of creating propoganda and maintaining control over populations.


#14

The point I lost in all of that is that I’m frustrated that the rich are getting richer, and the poor are becoming the new middle class, right here in America. If you disagree with that, you need to open your eyes. Individual situations mean nothing.


#15

Well severance why dont you email me your phone number and see if we can build value and find a niche you can use in your pitch. Believe it or not the nnumber thing is not as hard as you are making it out to be to beat. I have been in that position and have overcome it. Not saying its easy but it can be done.


#16

If I can help you with any sales related items please feel free to contact me as well. I am willing to assist you. I can look over your contracts and make constructive critique to better you. I have a bunch of good articles as well. In fact, I am reading one from a magazine and the title of the articel is “Knock low-ball compeitiors out of the running with a super sales presentation.” How ironic is that. Let me know.

**Marshall **- still haven’t gotten a response back in regards to you being booked for the season and how many jobs that might be ? Im jsut curious what your level of satisfaction is and or comfort level and what being booked for the season means to you. Thanks in advance.


#17

[quote=“timothy_71”]If I can help you with any sales related items please feel free to contact me as well. I am willing to assist you. I can look over your contracts and make constructive critique to better you. I have a bunch of good articles as well. In fact, I am reading one from a magazine and the title of the articel is “Knock low-ball compeitiors out of the running with a super sales presentation.” How ironic is that. Let me know.

**Marshall **- still haven’t gotten a response back in regards to you being booked for the season and how many jobs that might be ? Im jsut curious what your level of satisfaction is and or comfort level and what being booked for the season means to you. Thanks in advance.[/quote]

i did respond. i said i can sell easier because of lack of competition. i am pretty rural. my satisfaction level is 100%. i refuse to have a non satisfied customer. i dont have as big of a company as some of you here. i havent counted my contracts but its enough that i can pick what to bid on for the rest of the year.


#18

what I was getting at is how many jobs do you consider booked ?


#19

marshall, if you’re that busy, did you ever think maybe you are not charging enough?

Maybe the customer is going with you because you are the cheapest or close to the cheapest ?

so being the cheapest isn’t really being a good salesman, is it?

how many jobs do you have on the schedule right now?

I learned a long time ago, that if I am getting very busy, then something is wrong…mainly my price, and I better start raising it until the estimate/signed contract ratio evens out alittle. Sounds like you are leaving a bunch of money on the table, either that or you are working way too hard for your profit.

just asking.


#20

trust me guys…i know what the prices are. if you get 5 bids i will more than likely be 4th highest. (right where i want to be) . did you guys ever consider that maybe im just good at trust building. ask GTP or any other salesman…trust is the selling point , not price. if you can build trust you can charge what ever you want. my ave. is over $300/square for ranch straight shot 2 layer, no detail work. thats already way too much info for me to give out over a public forum.