An interesting article on some roofers work force


#1

telegram.com/article/20080410/NEWS/804100680
There were some other stories on this Tacori guy earlier. He came to my shop one time asking to sub work.


#2

thats what you get!!! some day It will be ok to be a real American roofer,shame on all of you dirty contractors who use illegal ?roofers?,some of us have put our whole lives into this profession and then get sold out by a filthy !!!


#3

Wow…thanks for sharing. Makes me feel like there might still be some hope. I wish that these companies that do hire these “illegals” realized what it is doing to not only the constuction workers…but the economy. You can’t tell me the this business practice is not effecting it. If the companies were’nt so worried about lining their pockets and sit back and realize it is also effecting the generations behind us. I have no problem with someone legitimately coming here and doing it by the law. I understand they want a better life. BUT do these large companies realize that they give these illegals an idea on how to do it themselves and they send all the money out of our coountry??? Do they realize it is hurting our children? These illegals kids our going to our schools now and getting educations and they will be running our constuction world…our kids are going to have to go to at least 4 years of college to make it…ANYWAY I am glad they did what they did to this guy he should be fined. I can only wish that you companies that do hire “illegals” would take a hard look at the big picture and what you are doing to our country!!!


#4

Blame the government. They are the ones who have let this happen. If this was enforced everywhere, we wouldn’t ever have had these issues to begin with. Alot of companies have no choice but to hire these illegals. It is very difficult to find good, honest, hardworking,non-criminal,probation prone white american workers. I agree 100% that these illegals should be arrested, but damn, our government has let this go on for years and not enforcing. It is always isolated cases like this, just to put a little scare in the illegals. Now the sad thing is, is that if they all of sudden got rid of all the illegals, our country would collapse.


#5

I am in Texas so I know all about the problem. I have a lot of respect for the guys that get up there and do the work, whether they are legal or not. It is hard to find people willing to do the work but with that said I really wish Texas would go to licensing like Florida. Yes it is a pain in the arse and yes there are still ways to use aliens but it does make it much harder and keeps them from selling jobs direct at half price.


#6

I’m going to play the devil’s advocate here for a minute.
From what i have read, this company incorporated, and was fully licensed and insured, although by an individual who could read no English, but had money just as green as yours or mine, who went to a specialist lawyer to set him up in a legitimate business
corporate structure specifically to avoid this happening to him. He paid the lawyer, he received his corporate documents, he obtained insurance, and he worked for some of the busiest residential roofing sales organizations in the area, and from what I can see, without too many complaints. So, our economy has sh&t the bed, and we’re all looking for answers…what’s the first thing to do…blame the illegal immigrants. If I paid an international corporation a big chunk of cash to make my corporation legal to work in say IRAQ, and ended up in jail because of something HE missed, in protecting me…I would be furious.
OK so, yes, he’s our competition, but from what I have heard in asking around about them is…their were efficient, productive, polite and likeable.
Every decade it’s one country or another…
I remember in the 60’s when the drywall trades and shingling work was all done by canadians…In the 80’s …the Irish, the Russians…and now South Americans. If someone was doing to YOUR immigrant grandfather ,what someone is doing here, how would you handle it?


#7

my immigrant ancestors that came here were LEGAL and paid taxes ! They also wanted to be American rather than just make money and leave. Thats the difference and its a big difference.


#8

[quote]A lot of companies have no choice but to hire these illegals. It is very difficult to find good, honest, hardworking,non-criminal,probation prone white american workers. I agree 100% that these illegals should be arrested, but damn, our government has let this go on for years and not enforcing. It is always isolated cases like this, just to put a little scare in the illegals. Now the sad thing is, is that if they all of sudden got rid of all the illegals, our country would collapse.

travis1…interesting thoughts. You are right It is hard to find good, honest, hardworking,non-criminal, probation prone white americans workers and let me add one more to that drug addicts. You know what when my husband was younger he could always find young guys that would work and wanted to learn the roofing trade. It is hard to get any younger kids to work. BUT, I feel because the roofing industry pretty much the whole construction industry has let it happen. Since companies hired illegals they made the prices drop in the roofing industry. They have made people with a ladder and a truck think they can sell roofs and then turn around and pay the illegals to do it. Some of the salesman do not even know where they need hit on the shingle with a nail. Think of it like this…if someone sells their house by you below market value that in turn makes you and your neighbors house just go down in price. Since these companies have hired these illegals they do not realize they are making the trade of roofing go down in price. Insurance companies look at all the prices out there and because of a company that hires illegals the price has plunged. I disagree that the economy would collapse if they deported them all home. There are A lot of people willing to do the work at the right price. Those americans that would work in turn would spend their money here…not send it back to mexico…

Wife of a Roofer
[/quote]


#9

are you serious?

I run a sales force with 12 salesmen. not a single one of them know how to swing a hammer, and to be quite honest, most of the guys who know how to roof, dont know how to sell.

I dont want the workers selling a $40K roof to my customers, and I dont want the salesmen nailing down shingles.

thats why there are different jobs.

yes, i know smaller operations work just fine, where joe’s roofing is just joe, and his cousin bob. selling and installing roofing. i’m not talking about that. I’m talking about REAL salesmen who know how to sell, and talk to people.

as far as the illegals go…

find me a white crew that shows up on time every day, does the job correctly, and … well hell, my list is huge, but i’ll stop right there, because not enough of them exist that could just do those TWO things for any of the rest of it to matter.


#10

I guess your salesman would be selling encyclopedias if they werent selling roofs for you. Some are quick to make a great blanket statment like “You cant get good white guys” or “the American kids are all drunks and on drugs” This just exposes what kind of phoney contractor they really are. a con artist salesman who never worked a real day in his life and a exploited illegal alien crew for the install. match made in heavan hey ?


#11

Fist of all there are no white crews becuse the have cut everyones throat they live ten deep in one bedroom apartment and all there money goes back home and its not America I see it firt hand i am in texas 9 guys on 23sq roof none of them speak english my father got paid more per sq in 1970s for new construction than they do now the have screwed the working guy everything your father his father worked for they lower our standard of liveing and you guys keep hiring them put hammer in your hand get out of that truck and get back up on that roof and stop hiring these little cock roach bastard


#12

Amen Jersey.


#13

no, because real salesmen dont have to sell encyclopedias.

real salesmen have people calling them every day offering them a job somewhere else.

real salesmen can close deals anywhere, anytime, to anyone, for anything.

phoney contractor? get real.

and i never said i hire illegal crews. are most of my crews mostly immigrants, and of mexican decent? yes. but the guys who run my crews are legal, and they carry workman’s comp.

i dont underpay. $50/square walkable roof is not underpaying around here. i have crews coming at me every day offering $35-40/sq. but they wont carry workman’s comp, so i dont hire them.

i have yet to have one single “white” crew come to me looking for work in the last 11 months. the last one was in January, and it was 4 guys who had been recently laid off from a local bus plant, and hadnt been in roofing or construction for over 10 years and were just looking to make some quick cash.

please. find me some good white crews, because i love white people as much as the next guy.


#14

I have all white employees. Well two of them are half mexican but they are all legal. All pay taxes. Are all drug free and know that if they show up at 7:01 they are fired. They show up on time everyday, work hard, and do such quality work that even the competitors respect us and our abilities. The only thing is that you would not be able to get those guys up on a roof for 50 a square. Roughly 12.50 per sq per guy? Yeah right. THAT is the reason why so many illegals are working. Only illegals would work for those sort of prices. Would you tear off and install a roof for 12.50 a square?

The salesman thing. I have had them. Seems the only thing they know how to sell is the lowest price and when you work for a compan that does not budge on its prices for anyone, they do not do to well. Someone who has been a roof and done it is a lot better of a salesman than someone who has never done it before. I had a guy with 35 years experience selling. (He has more experience than I have age) When we went to a house together so I could see how he sells a man asked him how the shingles are installed and how do you properly cure ice damming issues. The guy had no idea. He gets paid by what he sells. I ran an estimate for a roof that came out to 13200ish, he told me the homeowner got a bid for 10,700 and that he told the homeowner we could beat it. I told him things dont work liek that here and our prices are firm. Then he called me drunk one night and I fired him the nextday. The only useful salesman I have is the one who did roofing for a long time.

Its the guy who does the job for 10,700 that keeps me in business. The low bidder with the illegals working for him. He is the one who will eventually go out of business. The problem is owners who pay like crap who cant keep good quality guys no matter what color they are because I bet none of you guys would have got on a roof right before you started your businesses for only 20 an hour.

Hey Jersey, I hear you. My Gpa got paid more than some of these prices I have been hearing that are around the country. Then again prices are different all over. Something needs to be done where we people stick up for themselves and for the illegals. I have no problem with any immigrants if they are documented and pay taxes. GOOD FOR THEM and I hope they have a better life. I know of one company around here who hires illegals. Everytime I see a sign in a yard I make sure to stop and tell the homeowner and to be wary because they take the money and run. Even if they are working on the job I stop. The owner hates me. Oh well. Its not fair for the other 85% of us who are honest around here to have a competitor like that.

I rambled but this subject always gets me going. Take Care.


#15

You know what bothers me most about all of you immigrant/hispanic bashers is this. All you do is bi*%ch and moan about it, you complain, it is not fair.
We all know they don’t pay taxes. We know they probably fraudulate their w-comp audits(because they pay their workers cash)Lets put it this way. It is not going to go away. It will always be there. If you have so much beef with it, you have no business b*%ching about it, Go do something about it. Run for congress, run for governor, do something proactive about it instead of belly aching and whing and crying about it. You waste and consume so much time about it. You accomplish NOTHING by b*&ching about it. You are doing nothing about it by ranting and raving on these forums. PUT UP OR SHUT UP


#16

YOUR RIGHT ! Thats Why im doing something about it.
Im educating the the customers about some of the scum in the roofing industry that hire and exploit these poor souls. I also educate the consumer about the risks involved with saving money and hiring unqualified phonies impersonating a roofing contractor, as well as the risks in having people work on your roof that are uninsurable. I also let them know to beware of the pinky ring wearing salesman with smooth hands and no ladder. Yes I am doing something about it as should we all.


#17

Oh I forgot, Jim is perfect!


#18

No,Im not perfect. If you think I am then your mistaken :o , although thanks anyway.I just dont use subs or cut corners. I do have a passion for my trade that I have spent my life working in. I do care about my custumers. It always helps to like your job.


#19

I do my part!


#20

I do my part to i tell people every chance i get that if you hire one these guys that hire illegals and they fall off your roof they can own your house and then i explain to them that you cant get workers comp on guy that dose not have a ss card and if there illegal they dont have workers comp. Like i have said i love the spanish hate the illegals they drive prices down fuck every thing up for the working guy i know what your thinking but i have the ball to say it so do your part